Is it just me...

[DanM]

Yes. I know this is my first post in 2 years. But, is it just me, or do most kids that visit Space Camp not have a lot of interest in space? The first time I went, there were only 3 kids on my team who actually cared about space. The second time, I was the only one on my team who cared about space, and one kids told me to "stop talking about space," and I was bullied by him because of my interest in space(by that, I mean people called me a "space geek"). In the omnimax, one person said before a movie "I hope it's spiderman 3 and not some gay space movie." I don't get why anyone would go to a $1000 camp that you might have to fly to if they don't care about the camps special purpose.

[bnaivar]

Sadly, a lot of parents are just looking for a place to dump their kids. The ones that don't end up at Space Camp end up at Camp Whethafarkawee, or some such.

[DanM]

Why don't they send them to a regular camp? it just ruins space camp for those who actually care.

[Vincent]

Maybe, but every now and then (perhaps often, even), one of those kids gets to Space Camp and things change very suddenly for that individual.

And that's what makes Space Camp truly special.

[Boomerang]

I noticed this shift over my time at camp. When i started going back in the early 90's Ed Buckbee was still in charge. The camp was realy for kids who wanted to be astronauts. Buckbee saw it almost as a training ground for the future it seemed. I mean Space Academy Level 2 actualy had its MS/PS' s submit experiments for consideration to be flown on the shuttle.

When i was their in 93 and 96 it was still much the same but after Buckbee left in 94 i believe it was things started changing. Slowly but surely. When i returned in 98 Academy level 2 was now ASA i still had a mix of spce buffs and kids who were just there but it was obvous things had changed. ASA was now a shorter less intense program. Many campers were just sent ther by their parents. And the counselors often catered to those campers over the space loving ones.

Having worked their for a summer i saw it all the time. I saw alot of rich kids who mainly were there because of their parents. There are thankfully still kids who love space and space camp for the space side but things have changed alot. Sadly in the economy of the present day though i don't think camp could survive with just the space enthusiast. Even though it can be annoying the ammount of kis that come space geeks or not keep the place open. I would love to see it go back to the way it was but i don't see it happening.

[Safety]

I think there are a lot more "Space Geeks" and "Aviation/Military Junkies" out there than you would think. I think most of what you see is a front to be cool and what not. However its true there are some kids that come to camp... just for camp and even some kids that are there for their parents to get a break. But really why the kids are there should not be the concern, the concern should be what is done with the kids while they are at camp. What is being done to inspire them about space? Who is making the dream of flight special? What is being done to inspire them to better themselves? Who is inspiring teamwork and comradary?

I personally think there are two types of good campers...

1. Those who come to camp for a week to be an Astronaut or Fighter Pilot.

2. Those who come to camp for the social experience.

I think both of these styles of campers compliment each other in a good way. I would hope Administrator, Counselor and Camper alike try to encourage both aspects of coming to camp. Because both the experience of getting as real as it gets and experiencing a social environment in a setting away from home are equally important. Education, Experience and Culture are all equally important. Kids that come to camp, I would hope graduate with their wings and the seeds of several important life skills implanted with in them.

I truly believe that when you have a Counselor that cares and goes the extra mile every week, in a special place like the USSRC, you can truly teach and inspire a kid more in six days then you would be able to back at their home in an entire year.

It is what you do with the kids during those 6 days that will make the difference. The challenge for the Counselor to inspire their teams may get tougher year by year. But it's important to remember that greatness is not achieved in the good times, it is achieved when a person perseveres to not falter during the bad times. Or in our case weeks and seasons.

[Conan]

The upside is, that it is the dollars spent by the parents of the uninterested children that help keep Space Camp alive for the space geeks among us (and I bear that name with pride). Also, when you start attending the adult camps, you will find that all of the attendees are space geeks like yourself. The adults choose to come and spend their own money to do so, so you can be pretty sure that they share your enthusiasm for aviation and space. I think it is up to us Space Geeks to inspire others to share our enthusiasm, not to scorn them for being uninterested. In this way, we can insure that there will always be a Space Camp for us to come back to. (As I will be doing this July for my 12th time )

[pilotgirl21]

I personally think there are two types of good campers...

1. Those who come to camp for a week to be an Astronaut or Fighter Pilot.

2. Those who come to camp for the social experience.

I personally go to camp as a mixture of both. I have always had an interest in space and becoming an astronaut, but I realized after attending for my first time that the chances of becoming an astronaut are very slim.

Although I still have a huge interest in space, as an adult I attended camp as a way to get away from everything else for a weekend and to spend time with people who have interests similar to mine. I never really fit in anywhere socially, but I felt that at camp I was accepted for me, and that I can talk about anything without feeling different than others.

I made some good friends attending as an adult that I still keep in touch with. I found that most of the people I first attended camp with were like me: there for a bit of both experiences. I would have never returned if Space Camp was like school: all lectures and no fun. I would never pay that amount of money to be bored! The mixture of people attending brings out the best of everyone, although I do think that if you really were the only person in your group who was actually interested in space, then it probably wasn't the best experience for you...and I hope that future camp sessions will be much better!

[Hotdog]

I think Lisa has hit the nail on the head. It really is a mixture, even for us "Space Geeks".

It is a mix of "serious" training and simulations, as well as a cultural and social experience.

I am still in touch with several of the people I went to Camp/Academy with back in the day as a youth, and I can also chalk up my experience there to leading me to my chosen career.

I was focused as a trainee, hell-bent on being the "best pilot anyone has ever seen" behind the controls of the Orbiter sims at Space Camp. Not everyone on my teams were like me. Most were just there because their parents sent them there, or just for the social time. Most left the knowledge they gained about SRB's and SSME's in the parking lot when they left the grounds to board their planes back home. It was those few of us, like me, and the rest of you guys on this board, who were the glue that held our teams together. Part of the "fun" of Space Camp was having these "idiots" in your group, which challenged me to take on the role of a team leader to help mold these types into being participating and valuable team players. If I (or someone else) didn't, our team would fail.

[SpaceCanada]

Think of the movie...

If Kevin weren't there, the guy who didn't want to be there, would they have ever made it home? Maybe, but he helped keep things together at some critical moments.

All I'm getting at (and following what others have said) is the people who aren't interested in space have a role at Space Camp. They may not seem like they are interested in the lectures or the missions but they may take home a different set of skills - teamwork, tolerance, and maybe even a basic understanding of the shuttle. They will make friends (hopefully) and memories, and if they had a good time they will come back.

Some of the most friendly people on my second youth ASA team were the ones not as much interested in space. Sometimes the hard core spacey ones were too focussed on the space stuff and didn't want to have any fun, ever, and complained when we went on a picnic or had time slotted for volleyball. They complained more than the non-spacey people! I am not saying you are like that, but it happens.

Oh, and if everyone is all gung-ho about space all the time it poses some other interesting challenges. If all the pilots have their heart set on being CDR for the EDM/LDM it can be VERY messy when it comes to choosing roles. Believe me, I know, I was on a team like that. Having someone who doesn't really care if they are CDR or Space Station CAPCOM (I forget the real name off hand) down in MOCR can be a blessing.

All-in-all, you go to camp to have a good time, right? As long as you have a great time (and aren't causing anyne else to have a miserable time) that's what matters most!

[bnaivar]

I remember when I dragged my wife to an Adult weekend. I knew it wasn't "her thing" but she admitted she did have fun "some of the time". Hey, for her, that was a big admission.

[DanM]

I think "Good Campers" actually want to be there, whether they care about space or not. But I think it's bad that parents just dump their kids there, especially when the kid dosen't want to go. I had to beg to go, and space is my thing. But the parents who dump kids there could just send them to another camp, and get the same skills for much cheaper.

[pilotgirl21]

That's true, they can find a cheaper camp somewhere else for the kids who don't want to be at Space Camp. It does make me feel sick when I see the costs, knowing that there are people going to camp that don't want to be there. I had asked for years to go to camp, but my parents didn't have the money. Finally, when I was 16, my aunt and her friend volunteered to pay for camp (and a clothing package). I loved it so much, I saved up from my part-time job to return again to camp when I was 17. I think that as you get older, there aren't as many campers that don't want to be at Space Camp. It's the younger ones that get forced to go.

[Hotdog]

I did the same thing! Only my parents had sent me a couple of times already and were tired of paying for it, so I TOOK A PART TIME JOB JUST SO I COULD GO BACK TO SPACE CAMP and returned when I was 17. It was well worth it! I agree that it's true, the older the program, the fewer the trainees are "forced".

[SpaceCanada]

We still had a bunch of kids who didn't want to be at ASA in July 1998.

My parents didn't let us get big things like this for free - we had to contribute so we learnt the value of things. I had to save up all my income for a long time to pay tuition for my first trip to ASA. It took me two and a half years. My parents said they would pay for the flight if I paid for the tuition. The second time around I couldn't afford it, couldn't get a job, and was already in grade 12 so I applied for an academic scholarship and got one! My parents then gave me their air miles so I could go.

If you work hard for something you will appreciate it a lot more. I noticed a lot of people on my second ASA team had worked to get there. I think the kids who go in off-season are also a bit more dedicated since parents rarely send kids out of school to these things if they don't want to go.

[DanM]

Also, when you start attending the adult camps, you will find that all of the attendees are space geeks like yourself.

I just hope that won't end, especially with a reality show of some sort. I'm a Celebrity, Get me out of here, Space Camp edition.

Rod Blagojevich rides the MAT, and his hair stays completely still! Let's watch Heidie and Spencer try to run a shuttle mission.

[Mercergl]

I was lucky enough to only have one person on the team that nobody could stand each year. Sometimes it's irritating but usually they're not bad people, just not motivated. I think a good deal of people there are type 1 and 2 campers that safety (who I found out is awesome at 4 square this year) listed, I know I was.

[kidjim25]

I saw that as well. during the 3 times i was there as a teen. My first time there I was given my trip by my parents as an 8th grade graduation gift. my only experience with camp before that was on the Saturday movie of the week when they would show space camp and seeing the 10 second promo whenever someone had a chance to win it on double dare, legends of the hidden temple etc. So for weeks ahead of time i flew my virgin games shuttle sim and studied every manual and book i had on the bird. I wanted to be shuttle commander from day one and nothing was going to stop me. My team was made up of mostly the same type of people but we did have two who were the rich didn't want to be there and nearly got kicked out because of it. (sexual relations in the theater will do that every time) I was labeled a bit of a space geek but when we won spacebowl that all changed.....

The second time was international week and every single one of the people there wanted to be there. It was a dream.

The third time we had a mix and it was a detriment. lots of fighting and not nearly as fun even though it was xmas camp. (though showing Armageddon and not finishing the movie, and making us go to bed at 12 didn't help either) the best thing that came from that was i had my first true girlfriend come from that week. (story about that at a later date)

The point im trying to make though is the first time is still the one i talk about most even though we had a mixed group, and the third time my best friend was with me.

[SpaceCanada]

I think every camp will have a mixed bag of uninterested, interested, and die hards. It's the mix that makes camp so interesting.

In summer 1998 we had a good team but we didn't mesh very well. Some of the kids were uninterested, others were too involved with their friends or trying to impress the other gender, and some were just plain weird. I honestly don't remember much of that team - I focussed my attention on the camp experience itself.

In autumn 1999 my team was a lot more interesting. It probably had something to do with kids needing to get out of school to come at that time of year and thus wanting to be there. There were still a few super-annoying people, but overall it was a good team. I remember that team a lot because we got on pretty well. There was a good mix of serious and fun - you need that balance for a great week at Space Camp.

In autumn 2004 (adult camp) the team was really focussed. We still had two not-so-interested people but they didn't cause any trouble. If anything, it was the people who took it TOO seriously who caused a few hiccoughs in the week. Beyond that, we had another good balance between seriousness and fun. Then again, when you come to camp multiple times, you begin to understand how to add fun and interesting things to a serious mission - anomalies are just one example - make up a hilarious situation and then take it very, very seriously.

Good times.

[Hotdog]

So for weeks ahead of time i flew my virgin games shuttle sim and studied every manual and book i had on the bird.

I had the same game on my PC! Still got it somewhere. Loved the realism. At the time it was the most realistic shuttle sim ever made. Seems like my copy always froze during the Hubble mission if I remember correctly...